KALAFINA WILL BE IN MALAYSIA Anime festival Asia

  • Thread starter Thread starter Tatsuma
  • Start date Start date
Hello!

New to the forum and a new Kalafina fan! Thought I'd give my two cents.

After listening to the recording, I can definitely say that all the songs are out of tune to a degree - some much worse than others. Some people were saying that the recording could be making them sound out of tune - I don't think that's what wrong - they're just generally out of tune and have been for a number of their recent perfomances. There are nasty moments all over the place - Wakana in DU for example. That isn't caused by a recorder.

It's very interesting - I'm sure I'm not the only one who has watched the After Eden performances on YouTube from 2011 (or bought the DVD) - they sound absolutely stunning in those videos. They have the songs nailed and are able to push beyond "perfection", adding really great expression and feeling to those songs - They are far superior to the studio versions. They seem to be at the top of their game. I also don't think there's any auto-tune being sneaked in there (Diploma in sound production).

However, their most recently performances? It's like different group!!! Flat and out of tune across the board. Let's remind ourselves who these girls are - Kalafina! Specially selected by none other than Yuki Kajiura. Hikaru alone fought off 30,000 singers in her audition. These aren't your average run of the mill pop singers!

Something is seriously wrong just now - I really hope they fix it :<
 
on the contrary, i found their performances generally ok, with some less-than-perfect moments at certain parts. tuning-wise, sounds will definitely be different in an empty hall during rehearsal, and in a hall with screaming/cheering fans.

despite being kalafina, they are still humans and are prone to making mistakes too.
 
I'm new too, but I'll add my two yen.

I think the technical environment makes a big difference. The Blu-Ray concerts are absolutely amazing, and so are the Lisu-ani videos. But a great deal of that is because they have proper ear monitors, they have really good mikes, they have a PA sound engineer to mix the voice and band, and they have the manipulator to add overlays. Plus, they practice like mad the days before the concerts, they know the songs super well, etc.

Talent (of which the girls have plenty... and which Kajiura-san always stresses) is only a part of their singing performance. The rest is also a lot of hard work and preparation, both on the part of the singers themselves as well as the support staff. Considering the difficulty of the songs, that's only natural. I'm sure if you put them in a quiet room with no distractions and asked them to sing a capella individually, they'd nail it.

That said, I do feel that Wakana is pretty unstable recently. She sounded amazing in the 2010 Blu-Ray. In the last year or so, she seems to have good and bad days, and sometimes my throat hurts in sympathy when I hear her sing (again, this is all from YouTube, I've only been to AFA Malaysia and the concert yesterday). Again, considering she has to sing 2 hours more or less non-stop (they talk during MCs, so the only real rest is the encore interval), I think it's seriously tough and probably detrimental in the long run. It doesn't help that she has so many events, being in both FJ and Kalafina as well as doing promotions, radio, live appearances etc.

I also wonder if seating makes a significant difference. At yesterday's concert, I thought Wakana went flat several times, the most prominent being the "eeeee~~~" in Ongaku. But according to 2ch, Wakana was in great form and Hikaru was horrible. I did think Hikaru was off a few times, but it didn't seem as bad as people made it out to be. Totally weird. Makes me doubt my hearing.

For yesterday's concert though, I'm pretty sure a few factors caused problems. First of all, there was no sound engineer (it's not in the pamphlet, so I think Soundcraft couldn't pull their usual guy for a one-day gig and just made do with stock equipment and pre-setup). The balance was waaay off. I also think the ear monitors were stock - they seemed pretty big and Keiko kept fiddling with hers, a sign they are probably ill-fitting. Also, they only had 2 days of rehearsal with the band, so it's possible Wakana and Hikaru strained themselves in the days leading up to the show.

Doh I didn't mean to write so much. In short, I totally share your concern about the not-so-stellar performances as of late, but I'm hoping that it's not something wrong with their voices but just a combination of negative external forces. I don't know if I could live without Wakana's beautiful voice in Kalafina in FJ!
 
interesting view.

i agree that seating might affect what you hear, due to echos and others. so its more of external factors.

another thing that might be worth considering, is burn out. interviews, lives, recordings, and even more performances lined up, all these can affect the individual's condition.

not so sure about ytd's performance, but for AFAMY, while there were off parts, it definitely wasnt to the extent of being way below par.


anyway, what i was wondering is whether the ear monitors they wear, block out the liberty of adjusting their intonation to fit each other, during live singing?
 
AFAMY was my first experience with Kalafina, aside from some of the Kara no Kyoukai movies. I didn't notice anything off during the concert - I was too busy picking my jaw off the floor. After I heard the recording it definitely sounds off, but at the time, man, I was like totally covered in goosebumps.

Ear monitors allow singers (and band members) to hear themselves over the mess of noise that comes off the stage from the crowd, thus enabling them to tune their voices. Monitors used to sit as wedges on the floor but for some reason recently I see a lot of japanese singers using the ear monitors now. I think it allows for more freedom of movement because once you move out of the range of the floor monitor you wouldn't been able to hear. Also it prevents the feedback loop problem that sometimes occurs with mike and monitor.

Some people still swear by floor monitors though. Probably because sealing your ears changes the way air moves through your nasal passages and alters the singing quality. Also, you can't really hear the crowd, so it's not as lively. I have seen some people with just one ear monitor, as a compromise.
 
Yes, it's true - I think out of an entire band, the singer is the one who will always suffer most if they are not comfortable with some of the technical aspects of a show - Levels for their monitors for example. A group like that walks a really fine line, because they rely very heavily on one another. If one girl is out, it can potentially derail the other two, as it's extremely difficult to sing in tune when hearing incorrect notes/harmonies.

There are so many things about live sound I don't understand, but from what I gather, when concert volume increases, it gets harder for us to discern out of tune vocals and instruments, hence why some of you guys might have thought it sounded fine live?

Out of interest, what was the venue for Malaysia like sound-wise? Is it a bad venue? I live near Glasgow and it's only large scale live venue is an Exhibition Centre, infamous for sounds utterly terrible, because it wasn't purpose built.

Now that I think of it, a number of their past performances have only had them feature as part of a larger bill - so I assume everyone gets lumped with the same setup which could be a problem. The Tokyo Dome concert, however, was THEIR concert - everything would have been tailored to their needs. It also featured their definitive backing band (Kyoichi Sato is my hero 0_0) and I assume that Yuki Kajiura would have been involved in it too. I guess for the world-wide performances, Kalafina are just shoved on the plane and sent off!

I think there is only one way to clarify this and that will be when the next proper Kalafina concert takes place.

Sorry for writing so much :P I've been waiting to talk to people about Kalafina for ages but none of my friends are into them. Thank God for this forum!!!
 
^ Since when Kalafina performing in Tokyo Dome? Kalafina has never performed in a dome up till now. :swt:

ps. if you meant Tokyo Dome City Hall, it's not Tokyo Dome itself despite being in the same complex.
 
Sorry to pop in here, but for those mentioning the DVDs/Blu-rays as examples, they're all heavily edited with Studio Magix, as are all official video releases from both Kalafina and FJ. Hence, it's very tough to hear high-quality unedited lives...
 
That said, I do feel that Wakana is pretty unstable recently. She sounded amazing in the 2010 Blu-Ray. In the last year or so, she seems to have good and bad days, and sometimes my throat hurts in sympathy when I hear her sing (again, this is all from YouTube, I've only been to AFA Malaysia and the concert yesterday). Again, considering she has to sing 2 hours more or less non-stop (they talk during MCs, so the only real rest is the encore interval), I think it's seriously tough and probably detrimental in the long run. It doesn't help that she has so many events, being in both FJ and Kalafina as well as doing promotions, radio, live appearances etc.

I do admit that I've personally noticed as well that her voice seems to have deteriorated since last year, and I think you can see it in the Studio Magicked DVDs and official videos as well as unedited lives; just comparing Red Moon Live 2010 and After Eden Special 2011 DVDs, there's quite a difference there, as well as 2010 Lisani vs. 2011 Lisani, 2010 Animax vs. 2011 Animax...

...and this might be me overreacting but I even hear a difference in Wacchan's voice in their studio-recorded singles (e.g. in yane no mukou ni, she sounds a lot sharper on the 'yane no mukou niiiiiiiiii' than I thought she would).

The difference is still there even in FictionJunction (distance). To me, at least, her voice sounds thinner and weaker, and seems to have lost some of its old smoothness and elasticity (I also noticed she seems to struggle with changing notes with legato - she often breaks off and makes it choppy where it sounds like she tried to join them together).

It sounds like over-exertion of her voice, so I guess, understandably, given Kala's growth in popularity, she's just tired from countless rehearsals and performances (for FJ too and remember, Yuki uses her a lot as one of the main vocals in FJ songs), MCs, radio shows, interviews etc. (not to mention she's the one who loves talking the most XD).

Regardless, I'm sure she'll find a way to cope and get used to whatever's tiring/stressing her out. They say the voice is like a muscle right? So perhaps (I'm hoping) after a while she'll adjust and her voice will get stronger and return to its old self. In spite of it all, though, her voice hasn't lost any of its charming appeal to me. :ohoho: /is hopelessly in love :imdead:

Hikaru and Keiko seem to be holding up better...in fact, I think personally that Hikaru is on fire and that her voice has matured superbly :dote: :dote: Keiko always amazes me with her energy and stamina on stage.

Likewise, from what little I've heard from a few unedited live performances I've watched, I think Wakana has done an admirable job - Kajiura's songs aren't the easiest to sing and some of the high notes that are assigned to her sound like real killers. I have faith in her abilities. :sohappy:

I haven't been to a live myself so I really don't have any right to say whether they're good or bad, but I don't think the girls are unaware of whatever problems they have with lives (in fact, Wakana openly acknowledged that they're her biggest problem) so I trust that they're working hard, rehearsing and practising to fix any issues.

I trust that with more time and accumulating experience, they will get better and better. :sparkleguy:
 
Nah, they should have taken some rest. They're almost as busy as idol these days.
 
I watched them live at in Singapore (that was November last year) before seeing them again in Malaysia. Wakana was impressive in Singapore. I wax lyrical about Kalafina a lot but I didn't actually expect Wakana or any of them to sound so amazing live; I came out wondering why I'd doubted them.

In Malaysia, though...I still really enjoyed it (it helped that Hikaru was totally stealing the show) but even in the excitement of seeing them live it was pretty clear that Wakana's performance wasn't going to blow me away like it did before. I wanted to think that it was just a bit of an off day for her or something like that but with recent performances it really seems like it's a bigger issue than that :cry:

So yeah, Wakana does sound like she could really use a break. She's capable of giving incredible performances, and it'd be a great pity if she couldn't reach that level again because she's been overexerting herself.

But this is all just me, of course...I wonder if anyone else who saw them at these lives too can corroborate?
 
Yuki88 said:
ps. if you meant Tokyo Dome City Hall, it's not Tokyo Dome itself despite being in the same complex.

That was the one! My mistake! I know nothing. :plot:

ninetales said:
Sorry to pop in here, but for those mentioning the DVDs/Blu-rays as examples, they're all heavily edited with Studio Magix, as are all official video releases from both Kalafina and FJ. Hence, it's very tough to hear high-quality unedited lives...

Oh yes, I'm sure they are. They will have been polished to a sparkling shine. One thing I was taught in college, though, was that while you can roll it in glitter, you can't polish a turd - If it's bad to begin with, chances are it will remain bad. If those DVDs were COVERED in auto-tune, it would be very difficult to make it totally invisible:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VxZua0YytyM&

Listen to Art Garfunkel - He sounds like GLaDOS... That's post-production for you. :blood:

Auto-tuning the girls is definitely possible, but it would be tough to make it sound so transparent (Even with top quality software). Either the Japanese studio guys have Godly power or most of their performances are actually natural - or at least only softly auto-tuned. Sadly, there's probably no bootleg audio or footage out there from those particular concerts to compare! Will have to do some analytic listening!

Are we a bit off-topic here or are we good?
 
Re:

^Yes, it's really unavoidable nowadays :XD: And so, I shall give this "flood" my contribution :ohoho:


...and this might be me overreacting but I even hear a difference in Wacchan's voice in their studio-recorded singles (e.g. in yane no mukou ni, she sounds a lot sharper on the 'yane no mukou niiiiiiiiii' than I thought she would).

Guess that could be because of studio magix, her straining, or even a bit of both.


To me, at least, her voice sounds thinner and weaker, and seems to have lost some of its old smoothness and elasticity (I also noticed she seems to struggle with changing notes with legato - she often breaks off and makes it choppy where it sounds like she tried to join them together).

I'm not a fan of this kind of reply, but: +1 :XD: I say the same about her performance nowadays and in comparison to, say, 2008.

It sounds like over-exertion of her voice, so I guess, understandably, given Kala's growth in popularity, she's just tired from countless rehearsals and performances (for FJ too and remember, Yuki uses her a lot as one of the main vocals in FJ songs), MCs, radio shows, interviews etc. (not to mention she's the one who loves talking the most XD).

I do understand that they have lots of performances around, but I don't think that should be taken heavily into account, unless her endurance is really low - in which case, that should taken heavily into account and be a guide to their schedules. Wakana is still very young, not even 30 yet, and thus I don't think that her voice is wearing out naturally. Otherwise, none of the rockstars from the '70s/'80s would be stil performing nowadays - many of them are/were smokers, on drugs or alcohol, and few had/have any vocal orientation. Thus they should be all mute by now :XD:

Regardless, I'm sure she'll find a way to cope and get used to whatever's tiring/stressing her out. They say the voice is like a muscle right? So perhaps (I'm hoping) after a while she'll adjust and her voice will get stronger and return to its old self. In spite of it all, though, her voice hasn't lost any of its charming appeal to me. :ohoho:

I reckon that her singing has been declining for some two years at least. Guess that should be enough time for her muscles to "get accustomed" to...what? If there wasn't anything wrong with her, I don't think that her voice "muscles" would have to adapt. And to me, her voice is losing its beauty. I just hate it when I notice her straining.


I haven't been to a live myself so I really don't have any right to say whether they're good or bad, but I don't think the girls are unaware of whatever problems they have with lives (in fact, Wakana openly acknowledged that they're her biggest problem) so I trust that they're working hard, rehearsing and practising to fix any issues.

I trust that with more time and accumulating experience, they will get better and better. :sparkleguy:

It's actually pretty easy to find someone denying/ignoring or pretending that some problems do not exist XD Wakana may value Kala so much that, in order to not become a problem for it, she might be trying to ignore her voice issue and may be just hoping for things to get normal again. I don't know XD What I do believe is that she is having issues with her throat. And, if so, "working hard, rehearsing and practising" would only make things worse. And experience sure will make them better, but won't give them any magical powers to get over physical conditions like the one I believe Wakana is having. I see many comments here on the forum are optimistic just like that, but unfortunately I don't think that waiting for things to get better with time will work in this particular case of Wakana.
 
^ Agreed.

Wakana is indeed still young. I believe that your voice might not fully mature until you are over 35 years old, so her voice could still be developing.

Her parts in Yuki's compositions could really strain a singer who doesn't have proper technique or just lacks the natural range - A singer can really damage themselves by singing in too high a range for their voice (Ian Anderson from Jethro Tull is evidence of that). However, the girls have all had vocal coaching, according to the interviews, and probably still do - I'm sure she wouldn't be singing in that range if it was dangerous for her.

Whatever the case, hopefully it will be resolved!!!

Although, one thing about those old rock stars to bare in mind - half of them couldn't sing in the first place! xD
 
Re:

Mwhlr said:
Wakana is indeed still young. I believe that your voice might not fully mature until you are over 35 years old, so her voice could still be developing.

35? I would think 20 or something like that XD

Her parts in Yuki's compositions could really strain a singer who doesn't have proper technique or just lacks the natural range

But Wakana does have the range and she studied music, so I don't think that's part of the problem.

However, the girls have all had vocal coaching, according to the interviews, and probably still do - I'm sure she wouldn't be singing in that range if it was dangerous for her.

Wakana had training, I think Hikaru also had, but Keiko never studied music at all, as far as I know/remember. And I have huge doubts about "vocal coaching" that they or other artists may have. If they have any "coaching", I think it's no more than teaching warm up exercises, basic breathing, whatever. Sony is selling their image, and not their singing. They just have to look pretty, because studio magix can keep even "singers" far worse than Kala on the business, after all.

Whatever the case, hopefully it will be resolved!!!

Only if Wakana stops doing stupid things, like being part of two vocal groups while having problems to sing.

Although, one thing about those old rock stars to bare in mind - half of them couldn't sing in the first place! xD

That is true! LOL :XD: But even some of those are still "singing" nowadays :ohoho:
 
Worrying about your favourite singers is a natural part of fandom. I fully agree with the sentiment expressed in these last few pages about Wakana's voice. I mean, I watched an FJ video a couple weeks after I became a Kalafina fan, I was like, man that singer for Mezame intro is freakin' amazing, I wonder who it is, then the camera pans up and it turns out to be Wakana... That's how much I naturally love her voice. So it's also a really heavy weight to imagine that she's somehow past her prime.

But no matter what happens, the worry will always be there. If it's not Wakana, it'll be Hikaru (if I browse 2ch I start to feel paranoid), and one day it'll be Keiko. We just have to not wallow in the negative and enjoy things as they come. Each concert is a gift to be thankful, each new song is a treasure to be cherished. There'll be many more great things from Kalafina in the years to come.

Besides, nobody knows better than Kajiura the importance of Wakana's voice. Wakana's voice was the reason she started Kalafina. She calls it the voice of a goddess and you can tell she really loves it. She's also very fond of Wakana herself. Of all the Kalafina members, I think Kajiura interacts most honestly with Wakana. So I think we can rest assured that no matter what the evil (haha) record company and management company try to squeeze out of the group, Kajiura will be there looking out for her and guiding her.
 
Back
Top