I have bad reputation for Kalafina (Fandom/Vocal Unit)

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Kagayama: The last I remember they went after kouya ruten and anything gundam seed relate in 06 and 08. It isn't the first time that bandai or other agency took things down. Other kaijura singer aren't dealt too much in a heavy handed way though, if strictly just them on youtube. If it really is about all of the singers, then it really should be. Instead of substituting "we" meaning Kalafina or Wakana and Keiko, which is use frequently now. Until does more FJC releases with them all, not only those two, only then can I safely say that they mean it. Also, I don't question you integrity for treating all of the YK vocalist equally. Youtube went downhill after Google buys it out. So now, you can think of it as people spreading the take-downs That is actually I am stocking up on video sites that have public access without scary enforcement of contents. When I mean search every country, search every country video sites.

a-chan: Then I want them to have some normal life. I desperately want to think that, but the endless bullying tell otherwise. Perception and notions, are so important in singing. It's the difference between just getting by or have any form of success. It's a great idea, but in practice it is quite the nightmare. Instead of you don't touch mine, I won't touch yours. They broke their side of the bargain and start shoving it, when clearly people didn't what is going on. The picture is completely different from the actual picture. As for negativity, a little bit is perfectly reasonable. Instead of giving straight up denial and spite them, which is sours any relations. I haven't seen that many attempts of Kalafina or Madoka fandom to reconcile to the people they piss off. Which is why you have to enlighten me on whether they can soften their stance.

Kowz: .us one, not the 4chan. I did find several in 4chan time to time. You have to dig even deeper. It's a weird relationship. Saying they love doesn't fit either on that forum.

casarina26: Any artist can get a slice of the pie. The problem is Kalafina took the entire pie. That is roughly time I been lurking around here. This looks like an interesting site. I lurked even longer to get a better feel of the forum.

There is a reason why I am weary on youtube when it comes to comments. You haven't seen the comments in Kalafina's nowhere videos and the top relevance rated madoka nowhere. Those comments are even worse. Those angel gate comments are tame in comparison.

On the kaijura part, she is going to get hate one way or another. The thing is kaijura is reliant on Kalafina. Which is why the success has to treated as if they are in a mine field. Detractors are bad either, as long as it doesn't lead to more bad press. They won't do anything bad, just don't shove an agenda that will offend them. It is fairly obvious as well. It doesn't take much.

What I mean be personality: is the artist is utterly dependent on it for their success such as Usher and Justin Timberlake. They are doing it by one tv appearance after another, even franchise like Madoka does the the course a lot. Radio can be just the same with the antics. As well the pages of pasges of photobooks, that focus more them then the actual Japanese aspects. It is Usher having smooth personality. Kalafina is somewhat sweet lovingly cutesy kick with funny antics as their personality. It does not mean they are cut from the same cloth. That is out of the question. People never said anything like that. It's a instant bulls-eye on your back. Which is why it is never said at all to any artist.

casarina26, A petition may help, but I doubt they acknowledge it to the point to where they actually do something. Seeing as previous one from here didn't lead to anything fruitful. Other than a partial acknowledgement, then it was business as usual. Even if I did plan and do a petition after this, I think it simple wouldn't work. It has higher chances of being dead upon arrival to Sony and Kaijura as well as the person helping her. I just hope someone in Sony or Kaijura does checks this site. You'll be surprise, I do want Kaijura to fight back hard to gain back their personal lives. The real hard decision falls on Wakana and Keiko, I'm pretty sure both of them understand all the details. Maybe they can have solos career or group career from being thrown into the ringer.

My hope is for them is to dial Kalafina back to the point, where it they can have days off to do whatever they want.

Also, the link is here
http://archive.foolz.us/_/search/text/ kalafina /
You still have to do some digging. It's there, I don't want to make it too easy.

....:ouch::blood::imdead:
 
You see, the thing is we don't know, at all, what you're trying to say. That's not making it easy for us. Right now, it's downright impossible. We can't dig through over 2000 posts when we don't even know what you want us to see.

You think Kalafina is somewhat holding Kajiura hostage or something?
A lot of anime is made by Aniplex which is a subsidiary of SONY. Guess who owns Sony Music Entertainment? owned by SME (lol).
You're angry that Kalafina is getting gigs and FJ isn't? Aniplex has always gone to their own label for artists. There really isn't any conspiracy behind Kalafina being active... There is no Wakana and Keiko demanding that Kajiura make music for them.

The only person I see who is pissed off by Kalafina and the Madoka fanbase, etc. is you, really...
 
@aegis: Hmm correct me if I'm wrong, but are you trying to say that Wakana, Keiko and Hikaru (as individuals) are the victims of Kalafina's popularity and bad publicity by their label, that they are overworked, they don't get to have a say at the direction that Kalafina goes, that they are "caged and controlled"? :confu:
 
To answer to your perosonality paragraph, the success of of an artist depends too little on his personality. Example is lady gaga who is popular for making the weirdest appearances (outfits made of raw meet etc), and Justin Bieber who even though has been caught for criminalist acts or other strange things (check here ) but he's still super popular with the 15year and so girls.

Kalafina on the other side belong to a society were its not very well received to state your own opinion on issues/ act your own way (and thus in their interviews they always say what they have been order to, that Kalafina always consisted of 2 + 1 members). Also their promotion is based only on what the Japanese customers seem to want, idolish promotion, tons of merchnadise. They clearly dont have the non japanese fans in aim.

Also the music type plays an important role in the popularity, since their songs are made with influences mostly of classical, pop and traditional music, both except pop arent that popular nowdays. Also that the languge is japanese. Its not random that the biggest song sales are of english and spanish songs they are the most spoken languages in the world, while even thought Japan is second in music disc production, it mostly consumes its own music and doesnt export it, with exception of some bits to US and a few Asian countries, because japanese isnt a popular language outside of anime fans, outside of Japan.
 
I really have no idea what you're saying, @aegis. Honestly, no sense is being made.Stop beating around the bush. Tell us what EXACTLY you're upset about.
 
aegis said:
Kugayama: The last I remember they went after kouya ruten and anything gundam seed relate in 06 and 08. It isn't the first time that bandai or other agency took things down. Other kaijura singer aren't dealt too much in a heavy handed way though, if strictly just them on youtube. If it really is about all of the singers, then it really should be. Instead of substituting "we" meaning Kalafina or Wakana and Keiko, which is use frequently now. Until does more FJC releases with them all, not only those two, only then can I safely say that they mean it. Also, I don't question you integrity for treating all of the YK vocalist equally. Youtube went downhill after Google buys it out. So now, you can think of it as people spreading the take-downs That is actually I am stocking up on video sites that have public access without scary enforcement of contents. When I mean search every country, search every country video sites.
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I'm still not sure what you are trying to say... that Kalafina are a more closely managed unit that the other singers who have different recording contracts and management? That is probably more to do with Sony than Yuki Kajiura or the members of Kalafina themselves.

I buy as many of the CD's and videos of Yuki Kajiura's music and that of related artists as I can, that includes some special edition CD singles, the Gundam Seed / Gundam Seed Destiny Clipping 4 Songs DVD, Kalafina's Red Moon blu-ray, YK Live 2008.07.31 DVD, YK Live vol. #4 blu-ray, Chiaki Ishikawa's Own Write DVD, Yuuka Nanri's solo blu-ray...

Any clips of Anna ni Issho Datta no ni continue to get pulled from youtube and Chiaki Ishikawa also had to remove most of her own videos that she had uploaded to youtube.

If there is something that I like on youtube I'll use a youtube downloader to save the video as it may disappear at any time.

As far as Kalafina versus non-Kalafina live performances by singers associatied with Yuki Kajiura go, out of seven trips to Japan I've seen Chiaki Ishikawa live 6 times (and had tickets for 3 other performances of hers that I couldn't attend due to lack of finances), Yuuka Nanri live 5 times, Kaori Oda twice with FictionJunction and once with her own band, and Aira Yuuki once with FictionJunction and once with Ayane and Yumi Hara, in addition to the Kalafina performances I've already mentioned.

I haven't been reading or commenting on youtube, my understanding of the Japanese language is extremely basic, and I just enjoy the music and the atmosphere of the live events. Other fans and the artists' staff in Japan have been friendly towards me in spite of the language barrier which made the experience all the better.

Being a good singer is hard work, as is being a good musician, composer or lyricist. I don't expect Yuki Kajiura, her singers, musicians or other staff to be super-human, and just appreciate them for the music that they have helped bring to us.
 
@aegis : are you trying to say that : a) Kalafina being famous overshadowed Kajiura's other vocalists - like that angel gate live vol.4 that has some harsh comments towards Yuuka because people favour Hikaru over her? Or those Kajiura's songs covered by FJ that people are saying that their version is better? It's all a matter of taste, actually. b)Kalafina is more famous because ufotable/aniplex have been using their songs so much it is said that Kalafina, quoting one post from a post in foolz, is an overrated sh*t that's only famous because of Madoka and there are some people fighting all over the internet because of that? Again, it's a matter of taste. People can hate or love whichever groups they want to, and actually if you're a good fans you should be mature enough to not overthink those arguments-so do other Kalafina fans as well. There's no use overthinking everything. c)Kalafina has been making up their personality with that cutesy-blabla as you stated in your post? Now it's not only you overthink everything, but I think you also have some kind of prejudice towards Kalafina, as if saying that they won't be as famous if they don't keep that personality. They're public figures, ofc they need to keep their good personality. If they really have some kind of bad personality or something, that would be all over the media by now. d) you selfishly want them to keep a normal live - actually Kalafina's schedule is quite normal. They've been holding quite a lot amount of lives but that's the way of Japanese singers to promote their songs. Let's be honest, Kalafina's schedule isn't that full they keep doing live here and there. There are some intervals between them. They should also know that it will be the consequence of being an artist. Now please don't be angry at me, but looking at your post, I honestly thought that you don't really like Kalafina, especially Keiko that you've said her part is worse than pneumatic nail or whatever. You're just upset that Keiko and Wakana overshadowed Kajiura's other vocalists that you prefer. Again, that's a matter of taste so I wouldn't hold it against you but honestly, you're just exaggerating by making a thread saying Kalafina has a bad reputation. Kalafina's bad reputation is caused and being hold by those who hate them, but I won't hold it against them since it's their right. There's no need to overthink it. As for me, since I love Kalafina's songs, I don't and won't think about this bad reputation. Actually, like what Kirito said, Kalafina is vocally better, even if not perfect, than some other more famous anime singers.
 
:uh..: ...followed the link for about 10+ pages, all I got was tons of Boku no Pico troll posts (ED by Kalafina??? lolwhut???), your typical Kajiura v Kanno (v Sawano v Iwasaki etc. etc.) wars, and a string of posts about Kalafina being overrated etc.

Honestly, I don't think this is shocking news to most of us. A lot of the issues brought up in that link (e.g. recent Kajiura music quality, Kalafina songs all sounding the same, is Kanno or Kajiura the true Queen of Anime OST etc. etc.) are ones that have been simmering around for a while, not just out in the non-Kajiura-fan circles, but also crop up here from time to time. However, these are all questions of personal opinion, and it's pointless arguing over them because people have a right to their own views and preferences.

Also, with Kalafina's growing popularity, it's inevitable that people are going to say that they are 'overrated' etc. Every single popular band or music group faces that kind of criticism at some point, whether they are considered genuinely talented or not. This is simply because everyone's opinions and taste in music differ. I have no problem with people who don't like Kalafina's music (and hence consider their popularity 'overrated'). In fact, I don't even have a problem with people criticising Kalafina or Kajiura's music. They are also entitled to do that, as long as those comments don't cross the border into personal insults towards the girls as people. I understand that it's somewhat distressing seeing an artist you like being criticised and admittedly, a lot of those comments did make me uncomfortable and sad. But in the end, those people have the right to dislike Kajiura/Kalafina's music for whatever reasons. It still won't spoil my own personal enjoyment of their music or make me stop loving them.

That said, there was also a substantial amount of very positive Kalafina and Kajiura posts. In light of this, I don't think in any way that the negative comments on them are 'abnormal' or a cause for concern that Kalafina's reputation in general is going down the drain. There were plenty of pretty nasty comments about other popular artists on that link as well, not just limited to Kalafina. So like I said before, it's not just them - every artist faces some of this criticism. Especially, I daresay, artists that rise quickly in popularity like Kalafina did with Madoka (and I guess Fate/Zero). I suspect it's a bit of hype backlash as well, there, due to how huge and avid the Madoka fanbase is.

What I'm still not understanding is what you're trying to say with the 'personality' and 'image' thing and singling out Wakana and Keiko. Are you thinking that those two are *too* popular? :confu: That Kajiura fans are being too biased towards those two and basically saying that "Wakana and Keiko rule, all the other Kajiura vocalists Hikaru, Yuuka, Yuriko and Kaori suck"?

I concede that it does seem to be that most Kalafina fans (and indeed Kajiura fans) are biased towards Keiko and Wakana. But this doesn't mean the other girls aren't appreciated as well. Kaori has a lot of fans too. I think people were a bit mean to Hikaru when she first joined because of her newcomer status, but I rarely see that around nowadays. In fact, I think she's developed quite a strong fanbase as well. And there are a lot of fans who love all the girls. Perhaps not love them all at the same level, but still love them regardless.

And if we're talking about the unsavoury topic of member-bashing here, rather than popularity I think it's an issue of personal opinion/preference amongst the girls' different voices. And honestly, I really don't think it's a case of "Keiko and Wakana are the best/have the best voices/should sing everything, so that's why they should have sung this/that part instead of Kaori/Yuuka/Yuriko/Hikaru." I admit that I don't know about other forums that might talk about Kalafina because I really only visit this one. But even here, I don't think the 'member-bashing' is particularly skewed towards the non-Kalafina girls + Yuuka + Hikaru. If anything, I seem to remember on the last FJ live vol. 9 there was a lot of praise for Yuriko and Kaori (and Keiko). Similarly, look at how excited everyone was for Yuuka's 2-day vol. 14 release. On the other hand, it's not like Wakana and Keiko (as the two supposed most popular girls) are set up as some sort of unfaultable vocal goddesses. You only need to take a look at how much flak Wakana copped around the infamous 2011-2012 period when she seemed to be having voice issues to know that it's not like she's exempt from criticism just because she's one of the more popular girls.

I'm still really confused as to what you're saying about their 'cutesy innocent' personality...are you trying to suggest that you think it's...I dunno, some sort of 'act' they're propagating, and that they might not really be like that? :confu: I'm not sure why you consider that harmful because I would certainly rather they keep with their elegant/conservative/clean image. And since none of us know them in person, none of us really have any right to say that their true personalities are/are not the same as the image we've been presented with. For now, in my opinion, the group has remained true to their image and nothing I've seen in their on or off-stage behaviour contradicts the idea that they're very nice, modest, genuine, warm girls. So until something comes along to prove that they have some kind of 'darker side' or something, I'm happy to accept the girls as they are, whether that image be truly accurate or not. Besides which, I'm fairly sure that from 6 years of lives, performances, concerts, interview videos, behind-the-scenes, making of vids, blog posts and Kalafina Club, if they were the kind of girls to slip-up or fall into some sort of scandal, it would have happened by now.

Correct me if I misinterpreted what you were saying, aegis, because it is a bit hard to understand what exactly your gripe is - Kalafina's 'over'-popularity, their 'fake cutesy' image, or just Wakana and Keiko? :confu:
 
Even though the discussion is calm for now I warn people for future posts: If this thread ends up in personal or artist insults the thread will be locked and the bad-behaving users will be warned according to the >> forum rules <<
 
Kowz: .us one, not the 4chan. I did find several in 4chan time to time. You have to dig even deeper. It's a weird relationship. Saying they love doesn't fit either on that forum.
Click to expand...

Well, the foolz.us site is the 4chan archive. That's where all the threads from some boards are saved. And again, they're mostly pro Kalafina.

@Cerise
..followed the link for about 10+ pages, all I got was tons of Boku no Pico troll posts (ED by Kalafina??? lolwhut???)
Click to expand...

In that board, anime recommendations are not allowed, so when someone asks they post that copypasta.
 
a-chan: How can they be a victim of their own success, when they consented on the contract know what they are getting into? That is comes off as contradictory to being a runaway success. cough-Britney Spears...Unless they simply can't handle it, that literally doesn't make any sense with the actions they are doing now. Your getting something out of it and expect something in return. It isn't a gesture of good will. Otherwise, they would refuse the reward they are getting from that person or people.

Hatouchan:I read some bad discussion on the Otakon regarding Kalafina. I doubt it is just a few nips. As for Madoka and Kalafina, there are plenty of others artist Aniplex can choose rather than them. Instead it those the tried and so called true, and use kaijura and Kalafina. They can do something great, yet use the first card that comes up. Yes, that is literally how a lot of people of see Kalafina as. Where is a special collaboration that can at least make it different?....So....its the next twilight, which is previous the naruto as the extreme fandom. There is nothing stopping Kalafina from being seen that way as well. How is that great? That is absolutely terrible. Do you really want this? Since, it is lower than being shameful. If you can avoid battles, this would be it, since it is sparking battles it doesn't have to fight. Nor will it gain anything from it, just more people to be weary next time of a certain fandom.

George: Beiber doesn't count for he rode the first wave during the internet development. I is lucky to post youtube at that time, any later time, he wouldn't have thrived. It isn't an issue of right and wrong. It is preference issue that they place more priority on. That is a culture issue on focus on domestic and international. It's saying why people love nano. That is in completely different direction.

I have no qualms about them being idols. On the international issue, it was only a matter of time.

Kirito and ritarando: They are better marketed group. The preference can be quite the problem, when it is this large where it does hurt other communities regardless of forums and other meets up spots. The main issue is the fandom going out of control. If it was a fringe section only, it has no impact. When it being toss around like this, it is no longer a fringe section. Other groups, even other fandoms would try to get balance things back.

Cerise: Have you watch Pewdiepie on Youtube? That is what it means to charismatic, maybe cute to others. Personality is pretty much related to the character. Would you do criminal things. You wouldn't. Yet other time, that gives it such a savoring allure like a sugar rush you desire. That is pitch they are throwing. For less than fast elevator, they are expect to sell without a doubt. The innocent and timid is a strategy that is part of a stratagem Kalafina and lot of advertising use. Though, considering the medium, which is Kalafina, tailor to fit their taste. Even when those taste are at the very deep end of pool, they do knowing the money that can made is huge. They go to uncouth measures for getting certain fans, which should set up red flags of the danger. It still is propaganda. Alone, the propaganda isn't that scary. But once you factor the fandoms, this small non-toxic approach becomes toxic. Cerise, had it really been good intentions, they would have try not targeting those group in those means.

Cerise: It does have to deal with their over-popularity in general. In a way they are being handle a lot like PSY, though they did way more effort to have more control on image. As for Kalafina, it makes them too clean. As strange that may sound, it is like saying too much criminal history as well. The chances of stalkers and other paparazzi skyrocket from being that well known. Doing so without blending in,it is literally bugging them wherever they go. There is no way they can run away fast enough. The identity wouldn't matter, without very well thought clothes to blend it. The only other options of last resort is have official statements as well as restriction points. It seems they probably have guards around. I can be sure with other idols for they took training and so on. As for the Wakana, didn't people ignore pretty heavily. There wasn't that much complaints. It could be better, but I'll take it anyways. There wasn't any rethinking involve at all.

Also, you don't need a slip up to have a major fault. All it takes is too much misleading, without any from of in depth background to them in a personal way. Throw in hype to accelerate it even more, then it will burst the balloon or boil over. Scandals still are problems, but artist still find away as long as it isn't a core issue. Since bad reputation leads to scandals as keeps snowballing into other issues. Other time the bad reputation just sticks on without losing its grip.
 
Actually I still don't get it - what's the real issue here and what this discussion is trying to achieve. I don't think I ever will.
*happily unwatch thread and skips off into the sunset* :sohappy:
 
Just lock it. There's still no specific examples of "bad reputation" in this thread. Just aegis vs people guessing what he means.

Who the hell cares about Kalafina's members personalities or clean image? That would just mean Kalafina is not doing the music part right. :p
 
aegis said:
Have you watch Pewdiepie on Youtube? That is what it means to charismatic, maybe cute to others.
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LOL. Okay. Now I think you're just trolling. I had a 500 word response all ready but if it was hard to take you seriously before, it's nigh impossible now. You have a really funny definition of "charismatic".

And why bring up NeoGAF when you can hardly fill 3 pages of search results by posts for Kalafina there. There was like 1 single negative comment for Kalafina doing Aldnoah Zero. Are you sure you're not projecting your negativity everywhere?
 
grunty said:
Just lock it. There's still no specific examples of "bad reputation" in this thread. Just aegis vs people guessing what he means.

Who the hell cares about Kalafina's members personalities or clean image? That would just mean Kalafina is not doing the music part right. :p
Click to expand...
Agree with this. Actually I responded to this thread thinking that some people badmouthed Kalafina by saying that their musical quality is bad. While it's true Kalafina still has flaws here and there, this 'bad reputation' is actually some people hating them because they just don't like Kalafina songs, don't like Kajiura, or don't like the anime using Kalafina songs. It actually has little to no connection with their personality, like what aegis has made as such a big issue here. Maybe aegis takes that 'Kalafina is overrated' to a special extent. Some other extra points I get from aegis's post before : a)he/she overthinks those Kalafina's only well known thanks to Madoka and SME uses Madoka to promote Kalafina more because he/she'd rather have some other singer to sing it and maybe because it wouldn't cause the 'bad reputation' of Kalafina being famous thanks to Madoka. What you may forget here is that those people say that because they just don't like Kalafina or Kajiura's songs - again, it's a matter of taste. I would think so if the songs for Madoka are bad, but so far the single songs are good, with Mirai being the only exception for me. Even if I'm a fans of Kalafina and Kajiura actually I think that the songs for F/Z (ttb and Manten) and F/Z is overrated, but some people with different taste may have different opinion. So there you go. And that charisma comment is making me laugh I don't even know what more to say. It's still you having prejudice about Kalafina's personality IMO.
 
@aegis: If you dont like Aniplex using Kajiura and Kalafina, go complain to them instead of us. What I know is that Kalafina's and Kajiura's music for madoka has been very popular world-wide with numerous vocal and instrumental covers of credens justitiam and sis puella magica etc, and Magia by fans all over youtube, and numerous orchestra concerts organised by SME all over japan and even a mandolin concert by independent orchestra. This is a forum that likes Kajiura and Co's music. An other one made by haters, ended up closing, if you know what I mean ;) Thread locked.

Fixed the title so that it reflects your opinion clearer :)
 
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